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CK (Spoilers, blah blah blah)

Ford_PrefectFord_Prefect
edited September 2004 in Dark Tower
Spoilers....







































Rolands confrontation with the CK. I have to admit that this was, for me, the weakest point of the book and, perhaps, the entire series. No palaver? No explaination of CK's backstory?He is the big evil villian and he just yells a lot and just gets erased? Where is the powerful character we saw in Insomnia?



Also, what about the mythology created in Black House? This doesn't fit with what we learn in DT7. Could the events of BH occur later, during a future loop? Also, the Three Kings said that the CK couldn't get in the tower without one of Roland's guns. But, he did get into the tower. That is how he got trapped on the balcony. He entered the tower and the went outside through the room from Roland as a toddler and got stuck. But, he did get in the tower without the gun.



Maybe this will make a bit more sense when I have thought about it for more than a couple of minutes.



That all being said, the book was amazing. Of course.

Comments

  • Ford_PrefectFord_Prefect
    I also thought the confrontation with CK and the death of Flagg ws somewhat anti-climactic



    CK could not get to the TOP without Rolands gun. The touted 'top floor'He could get in just not very far.



    Nothing about Tyler, not even a mention. That also threw me off.Or of Jack, Rose madder, Buick 8....etc.....
  • newinsidenewinside
    CK could not get to the TOP without Rolands gun. The touted 'top floor'He could get in just not very far.


    But Roland left his gun at the door to the tower. I would have thought that Roland would have needed the gun for anything that the CK would have needed it for.



    I wasn't surprised to not see Tyler, since I thought the whole point of BH was, basically, to explain why Tyler wouldn't be there. I have also always thought that Jack's story was done and it would have be a wrong move to have him show up. The connections with Rose Madder (Lud) and Buick 8 (King has said that the car was one from a low man) were not about characters, so I would have been very surprised to see anyone from them show up.
  • BevVincentBevVincent
    CK had his birthmark to get him as far as he did, but then he got pissy and burned it off, trapping him on the outside of the Tower again. Roland used his gun for all it was needed -- to gain entry. i.e. Roland shows his I.D.



    I consider the DT info in Black House to be "lore." Some of it is legend, some of it is fact-based, none of it is to be taken as the strict truth. No one in Black House knows anything on a first-hand basis, not even Parkus.
  • Ford_PrefectFord_Prefect
    Roland was also the last of the line of Eld. that was his 'identification' to get to the top. only one of them could do it. Hence Mordred, up until his death HE was the last of the line.(plus his birthmark)
  • newinsidenewinside
    Okay... now I am just jumping around as thinks enter my mind...



    What about the belt at the end of W&G? And, didn't Roland say he had a run in with Rhea again? I guess we didn't get those stories.



    Also, I was hopeful that there would be an explaination as to how Cal Tower's ancestor had Roland's family name written down.



    Now I am just being picky, I know. :)
  • newinsidenewinside
    Ford_Prefect wrote: Roland was also the last of the line of Eld. that was his 'identification' to get to the top. only one of them could do it. Hence Mordred, up until his death HE was the last of the line.(plus his birthmark)


    There was a line in there that said that the CK was of the line of Eld as well... if I could just find it.  :-/



    Edited: Here it is. Pg. 176.

    "Hile, Mordred Deschain, son of Roland of Gilead that was and of the Crimson King whose name was once spoken from End-World to Out-World; hile you son of two fathers, both of them descended from Arthur Eld, first king to rise after the Prim receded, and Guardian of the Dark Tower."
  • Ford_PrefectFord_Prefect
    hmmmmm, well crap. where's bev? *looks around*

    Guy is never aroud when you need him. I am not going to look for my quote but somewhere it says why only Roland can get to the top. And it has SOMETHING to do with the lineof Eld.
  • eta6eta6
    CK was said to have descended from Eld, doesn't mean he was the last of a true line, like Roland.



    That's what I gathered
  • DemDem
    I guess I have to wonder why the "burning the birthmark off his heel" info didn't make it into the actual book, but then again, I just kind of assumed that the CK was on the balcony because he was looking for Roland. I guess I didn't see that it was explicity stated that he couldn't come back in off the balcony, he just couldn't gain the top of the tower. That was my take anyway.
  • Tobey_StarburstTobey_Starburst
    How does everyone visualize the Crimson King? A mad Santa Claus with a big hook nose?
  • DTUKDTUK
    Pretty much, yeah ;D
  • Tobey_StarburstTobey_Starburst
    I wish King would have revealed his origins. Where he came from and how he became so powerful. Supposedly he is also descended from the Eld, could that mean that he started off good and became evil along the way?
  • DTUKDTUK
    What if CK is the original Eld? His description would pretty much describe King Arthur in his final years.



    Could it have been Arthur on his quest to find the Holy Grail that he switched dimensions and worlds and ended up finding the Dark Tower which would presumably have been white to start with?



    Then he spent millenia alone and went insane.
  • DemDem
    That's a great theory, especially in light of the Arthur Eld tapestry in the Dixie Pig, but I don't think it holds up. If I remember right, Flagg states in "The Shining Wire" that both Roland and the CK are descended from Arthur Eld. Then again, the DT series is open enough, and Flagg unrealiable enough that you could make a case for that theory.



    Or maybe he's Roland from the previous loop ???


  • Tobey_StarburstTobey_Starburst
    He is not Arthur or Roland.



    Arthur did find the Holy Grail, so how could he still be searching for it and get lost between worlds? The last we saw of Arthur was when he was being carried away by the lady of the lake on the boat to wherever. He was murdered by his son Mordred.



    Roland does not branch off, he continues the loop. He goes from the Tower and back again. Also there is only one Roland so you can't say he is Roland's Twinner either, I think this was explained in one of the books that he is a single being. There are no other Rolands throughout the millions of worlds .
  • crimson_queencrimson_queen
    ALL HILE THE CRIMSON KING!! ;DAs for his looks,he is probably one of the most handsome'men' you have ever seen,If he chooses to show you his real face.I don't think of 'Santa' when I hear his great name. Maybe he started as a good man from the line of Eld.Maybe he started working on the lower levels of the Tower,and realized how much power there was in it.Then somehow started work on the upper levels of the Tower, as some kind of servant ie..the little bald docs,or Walter if it does ya.And became so infatuiated with it that he became this great evil eternal being and wanted the Tower all for his Great Self.At any rate the CRIMSON KING deserves more than just being erased!!I mean NO BATTLE with him,no back story to who/what he really is/was. You must show more respect for the RED KING than that!!After all he's the one running things in End-World.ALL HILE THE CRIMSON KING!! ;D

    -Crimson Queen
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